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That the Sums were a bit more pop... I know its playing devil's advocate, but as my favorite band, I wish they were more heavily scrutinized and in the public eye just so we could have more stuff to be excited about.

No one makes better music to me then them, but then its so easy to forget, because their impact these days is so small.

What would it take to make the world realize how talented the Sums really are again, would it be that happier music Deryck was talking about at the end of the SBM Doc perhaps?

Its the lack of videos for this album that really left me scorned as a fan cause it was so damn good.

How could you consistently have such good music, excellent writing, and everything, but then the marketing be so lax.

They really need someone who cares about that kind of stuff imo, something as simple as a creative video, a movie scored by them, anything.

They have so much potential its crazy, even the fuckin snobs at the Grammy cant hate!

I digress tho, opinions?

We've discussed this a thousand times. The Sums aren't in the mainstream because they don't want to be in the mainstream. They care about their fans and their fans only - as far as they are concerned everybody else can go fuck themselves. The lack of music videos hasn't been their fault - SBM wasn't released because it was too gory/violent, and the BIME video hasn't been released yet because the Canadian government hasn't approved it. Music videos are pretty much a way of making money - promoting your music by getting air-time on TV with your singles. While gory/violent music videos might be appreciated by the fans, in general they're just a waste of time if they're not going to be played outside YouTube. The guys release and album, and tour the shit out of that album so as many of the fans can hear it live as possible, then write another one and tour the shit out of that. Making money or trying to appeal to the mainstream has no part in the equation.

In black and white: Sum 41 are not a mainstream band. If they were mainstream, they would change how they acted and the music they produced. Which the fans would hate. Now who is more important - the fans, or the rest of the world? Respect vs. money. Hmm. Looks like the band have some core values not shared by most of the rest of the music industry.

All they truly need is a good record label that cares about them and recognizes what a great band they are, and actively promotes them. I totally get what you're saying though.

I wish everyone could realize how good this band has become and how they've evolved over the years while still maintaining that same attitude they've had in their music.

However, like Tomi revealed, Chuck wasn't going to be released since it had "no hits". If Sum 41 was popular again, the label would want to cash in on it and then they'd be almost forced to write "hit" songs again. Needless to say, albums with the freedom like Screaming Bloody Murder wouldn't exist.

oh come on !! NOT AGAIN ...

I don't want them to be mainstream, then more people would go to their shows, and I have less of a chance of being brought up onto the stage!

Ardi41 wrote:oh come on !! NOT AGAIN ...

^this

It's not Sum 41's fault that they aren't in the public eye anymore. They do have songs that could be mainstream singles, even on the Screaming Bloody Murder album. "Baby You Don't Wanna Know" is a fairly catchy song, and it may have made a great single at one time, as is "Time For You To Go". Even a song like "Screaming Bloody Murder" would have been a solid single at one time potentially. The problem is that we're in the year 2012, not the year 2005.

The current top 10 radio singles on Billboard? The most "Rock" song on there is a song titled "Payphone" by a band called Maroon 5. Want to know something else interesting about that song? The song features Wiz Khalifa.

The current top 10 selling singles on iTunes? Maroon 5 is there, as well, along with Owl City and Fun. as the most "rock" of any of the groups on the list. Owl City's song features the "Call Me Maybe" chick, and Fun.'s breakout single featured some radio chick I've never even heard of.

You don't want Sum 41 to be a "pop" band. You want them to continue to make the music they want to make. If they were another "pop" band, their next album would probably consist of about 10 songs (Fun.'s album has 10 songs, as does a good majority of the "rock" bands employed these days), at least 2 of which would be bullshit songs created specifically for the radio about calling someone from a fucking payphone in the year 2012 where payphones have been irrelevant for a decade or a song about some chick dancing in front of you at a club with obnoxious synthy bullshit...

Point is, this band once made music in genres that the mainstream actually cared about. This band was releasing songs like "Pieces" in the same general era of music where Hawthorne Heights wrote lyrics about cutting their wrists. You can't continuously change your sound to fit with the mainstream, or you end up sounding like Maroon 5, or you take the turns Linkin Park has taken, and you just sound like mediocre rock music.

Like I've said before on here, music videos are cool, but they're not everything. Most bands don't make really interesting music videos anymore, anyways... can't you just check out their live shows on youtube and feel happy about that? I don't know, who cares what other people think of what you listen to? They're right, Sum 41 is a band that was popular a few years ago, and that's the same way with the other bands that are kind of on their level in terms of popularity. Bands like Blink-182 and Green Day have been able to stay elite in terms of popularity, but after those bands, what "pop punk" band has contained the level of popularity they used to have? Honestly, Sum 41 has done really well... look at what has happened to bands like Good Charlotte and Simple Plan... even bands like Hawthorne Heights and From First To Last, major fad bands, have fallen down real hard.

Basically, be glad Sum 41 is still making music and touring as much as they are. They're making videos, too, but they've just been unlucky when attempting to release them.

Alot of yall are missing my point.

How long you gonna sit here and blame the record labels when these dudes are millionaires.

With their income, they should be singularly motivated to do shit on their own and not just take the 12 year old position of "I dont care about it so oh well, im just do what im doing"

If I made an album as good as they did and just had to pull together 100k to put together some nice creative videos, then why the fuck not.

You say its all about the fans, but im a fuckin fan and i want videos. So do millions of their other die hard fans.

Yall sound like the damn record companies yourselves, pretty much saying that their songs arent worthy of attention or creative expression through video because they are not "mainstream". What kind of cockamamie bullshit is that, its fans like yall who create a condition where this band could be so lazy when it comes to anything but touring.

I did not say one thing about radio play or selling out or changing their sound. Im just saying more people deserve to hear their sound as it is, but because of their attitudes, no one out side of the 50K die hards ever will. Its situations like this that make classic albums lose their sustainability. Music is not just about an album anymore.

The record companies not gonna put extra time and effort into promoting some men that act like fucking kids, and apparently the bands not gonna do so either...

Oh well, theyll stay my favorite band and ill always buy their shit, but they are terrible role models and business men, and me liking their music doesn't change that one bit.

I've probably said this about 12312312 times on this website.

You're a fucking idiot.

They're clearly not motivated to create music videos, which is why they've only created two separate videos for Screaming Bloody Murder. Oh, and of course it's their own fault that they don't want to create a shitty dance-pop song featuring Pitbull in order to earn a couple extra dollars and to please idiot fans like you who cry because your favorite band isn't being forced down the mouths of millions of people.

You're right, touring is a pretty lazy endeavor. Let's go create more music videos that won't be released anytime soon! We already have two of those that haven't been released yet on this album, so let's make another! Great idea, guys! Let's spend money out of our own pockets to fund a music video that probably won't be seen anywhere other than YouTube! That worked so well the last two times we tried it, so it'll probably be a hit this time! Yeah! Great idea!

My band is already big enough to embark on headlining tours all around the world, playing shows in front of sold out crowds in foreign lands... we need a third music video so maybe this time it'll be released for the fans that don't attend our sold out shows... maybe they'll show up next time and the shows can be sold out faster!!! OMG! GREAT IDEA! I need this video. My band is just a group of awful businessmen, so we neeeeeeed a music video!

Also, bad role models? What does that have ANYTHING to do with not releasing a music video?

bizzyd676 wrote: You say its all about the fans, but im a fuckin fan and i want videos. So do millions of their other die hard fans.

you "fans" make me sick and its not Sum 41, but every band's fans. there's your group of fans who seem to think because you buy (or listen to) the music a band makes, you get to tell the band what to do.

Hey, i've got a newsflash for you SUM 41 DOESN'T OWE YOU ANYTHING. move on with your life and just be thankful you can listen to any kind of music you want whenever you want. why can't that be enough?

FYI:

-The record companies own the songs, no video gets released till they give their permission.
-100K is more than they've made on this album, so pulling that together for a videos is a no go..
-There are no millions of die-hard fans, hundreds is the amount we're talking about.
-We're talking from the label's point of view when we say there's no point in creating a video cause they're not mainstream, why release a product when there's no market? Making profit is their core-business, not helping a band out.
-The band is not lazy when it comes to anything but touring, have you ever checked their youtube channel, FB, twitter etc.? I have yet to find a band that keeps in touch with their fans the way Sum 41 do.
-Radio play, touring and social media is what attracts people, not a music video that probably won't get any airplay.
-Their attitude has nothing to do with this, it's all about the label and money, they love their fans and do anything to keep them satisfied.

I'm also looking forward to their music video(s), but it won't do jack shit about their (lack of) popularity, we live in an era where garbage like lady gaga, justin bieber, 1 direction and nicki minaj is considered music, deal with it...

I just want to SEE the music video. I don't really care anymore if it affects Sum 41's popularity or not. That's my stance on it.

Trainwreck wrote:I've probably said this about 12312312 times on this website.

You're a fucking idiot.

They're clearly not motivated to create music videos, which is why they've only created two separate videos for Screaming Bloody Murder. Oh, and of course it's their own fault that they don't want to create a shitty dance-pop song featuring Pitbull in order to earn a couple extra dollars and to please idiot fans like you who cry because your favorite band isn't being forced down the mouths of millions of people.

You're right, touring is a pretty lazy endeavor. Let's go create more music videos that won't be released anytime soon! We already have two of those that haven't been released yet on this album, so let's make another! Great idea, guys! Let's spend money out of our own pockets to fund a music video that probably won't be seen anywhere other than YouTube! That worked so well the last two times we tried it, so it'll probably be a hit this time! Yeah! Great idea!

My band is already big enough to embark on headlining tours all around the world, playing shows in front of sold out crowds in foreign lands... we need a third music video so maybe this time it'll be released for the fans that don't attend our sold out shows... maybe they'll show up next time and the shows can be sold out faster!!! OMG! GREAT IDEA! I need this video. My band is just a group of awful businessmen, so we neeeeeeed a music video!

Also, bad role models? What does that have ANYTHING to do with not releasing a music video?

The reason why they are not very popular is simple: People see them as a one hit wonder-band. It's hard to change one's image and retain popularity when you start as a bunch of teenagers, doing music for teenagers. Either the artist has to grow along with the fans and adjust it's music (Like the Sums have mostly done) or try to stay a teenager, which of course, is an impossible task. Teenagers want to relate to the artist, but when the band is 30'ish singing about teenager-problems etc. I don't think it's very convincing.. I'm glad though Sum 41 have mostly avoided the latter. (I think one reason UH got their worst reviews yet and sold bad is because it had, well um... whiny songs trying to appeal teenagers. sorry UH-fans.)

And yes, most people will always remember Sum 41 from Fat Lip and consider them a extremely commercial pop-punk band, unless The Sums can pull out some new über-mega-hit-song from their sleeves.
Also to those who say that Sum 41 is not motivated to sell well - I think you're fooling yourself. Of course they want to sell well. It's their job. Kinda like saying that a sports athlete doesn't care about success. I'd like to add though that it's a bit of a dilemma that Sum 41 is considered by many a "sell-out band", yet they've done almost everything they can to change that.. (Few mishaps here and there..)

And finally everyone must remember what has been said in this thread already for countless of times: Rock-music is no longer as popular as it was ten years ago. Only a couple of rock-bands can be considered HUGE nowadays. Personally I don't care if their popularity skyrockets again, what matters to me is that they keep doing what they've been doing and I get to enjoy their shows and awesome songs.

What's funny to me is just how this guy acts like it's Sum 41's fault that they haven't released either of the music videos they shot for this album.

As far as Sum 41 being a one-hit wonder band, I think they're a bit more than that, so it's kind of odd that the public seems to feel that way. I guess it was the only number 1 hit they've had in the US, but they've had plenty of "hits" in the US, just none that were THAT high up. Still Waiting, Pieces, In Too Deep... they all were decently popular tracks in the US... and in Canada, Sum 41 was almost guaranteed to have a number one single on each album.

It's weird to me, just how much more appreciated the band is in places like Canada and the UK. I understand that they are Canadians, but it's weird to me that it's so important to be born there, because so many foreign artists are huge in the US (so long as they make Americanized music, I guess).

I dunno. I don't mind bands I like being "one hit" bands. I mean, Jimmy Eat World is considered a one-hit wonder, and they're one of the greatest rock bands in the last 10 years.

I think the biggest problem is that people on this website like to put Sum 41 up there with bands like Green Day and Blink-182, when in reality, they're more like bands like Good Charlotte and Simple Plan, albeit much more talented than those bands, just more similar in terms of popularity. These bands all peaked the same way, and they all fell the same way... the difference is that the other two bands are completely irrelevant now, and Sum 41 is churning out the best music they've made since the mid-00s.

As far as Sum 41 being a one-hit wonder band, I think they're a bit more than that, so it's kind of odd that the public seems to feel that way.

I agree, they are more than that. But at least here in Finland if I ever encounter a person who knows Sum 41, it's most likely because of Fat Lip. And for example during their show in Helsinki the one thing that annoyed me the most we're the people screaming FAT LIP after every song.

It's weird to me, just how much more appreciated the band is in places like Canada and the UK. I understand that they are Canadians, but it's weird to me that it's so important to be born there, because so many foreign artists are huge in the US (so long as they make Americanized music, I guess).

I think it's a well known fact (In Europe at least), that European bands often don't even try to make success in the US, since it's hard for anything else than American to sell there. No kidding. This even applies to British bands. A far fetched comparison I guess, but it's bit like your politics where it is actually BAD for a President to speak a foreign language in addition to English. Anything foreign seems to be bad.

Also it may sound weird but here Good Charlotte and Simple Plan got tons of radio play few years back, I dunno' if they still do. But I've heard Sum 41 played like 5 times in radio during my life. haha. And yes, Good Charlotte and Simple Plan are horrible, horrible bands.

bizzyd676 wrote:That the Sums were a bit more pop... I know its playing devil's advocate, but as my favorite band, I wish they were more heavily scrutinized and in the public eye just so we could have more stuff to be excited about.

No one makes better music to me then them, but then its so easy to forget, because their impact these days is so small.

What would it take to make the world realize how talented the Sums really are again, would it be that happier music Deryck was talking about at the end of the SBM Doc perhaps?

Its the lack of videos for this album that really left me scorned as a fan cause it was so damn good.

How could you consistently have such good music, excellent writing, and everything, but then the marketing be so lax.

They really need someone who cares about that kind of stuff imo, something as simple as a creative video, a movie scored by them, anything.

They have so much potential its crazy, even the fuckin snobs at the Grammy cant hate!

I digress tho, opinions?

hh, you serious ? Why would they need talent to be popular ? Is Lil Wayne the wanna be gangster talented ? Popularity in this industry takes away your freedom, the major labels are completely taking over the music that we are forced to listen to... and the other thing, Sum 41 are not bad, but the word excellent is out of place, if you wanna use that word, you should use it when talking about Pink Floyd, The Beatles or The Who...

X^2 wrote:Also it may sound weird but here Good Charlotte and Simple Plan got tons of radio play few years back, I dunno' if they still do. But I've heard Sum 41 played like 5 times in radio during my life. haha. And yes, Good Charlotte and Simple Plan are horrible, horrible bands.

I think they still play Simple Plan (at least the song Summer Paradise has been a lot on the radio this spring/summer) but now that I think about it I haven't heard much Good Charlotte recently. Still, both of those bands are way more popular here than Sum 41. I have never heard Sum 41 on the radio.

Susanne wrote:

X^2 wrote:Also it may sound weird but here Good Charlotte and Simple Plan got tons of radio play few years back, I dunno' if they still do. But I've heard Sum 41 played like 5 times in radio during my life. haha. And yes, Good Charlotte and Simple Plan are horrible, horrible bands.

I think they still play Simple Plan (at least the song Summer Paradise has been a lot on the radio this spring/summer) but now that I think about it I haven't heard much Good Charlotte recently. Still, both of those bands are way more popular here than Sum 41. I have never heard Sum 41 on the radio.

Oh geez, look what I've started. Okay, maybe Sum 41 is more comparable to Yellowcard, then. Yellowcard is a band that had a huge hit with Ocean Avenue, but has since then sort of dropped off. They still make really good music, and they have their own unique sound, but they just haven't been able to replicate that success they had in the early-mid 00s.

As far as radio goes... I think it depends where you live... a lot of people on this site seem to really love the radio station around my area, which is a station called 89X, and I think that station premiered Screaming Bloody Murder, or Blood In My Eyes, or maybe it was in the UH era, and they premiered one of those songs... I forget, but regardless, they still play all of the bands that have been mentioned in this thread. They're the "new rock-alternative" station. Also, I know that there's an XM radio station that I heard Jessica Kill on when I was in my car once, and I was just kind of flipping channels because I don't really listen to XM and don't know the good stations.

I think a testament to Sum 41's popularity is the fact that even on an album that had very little mainstream success, they still had a song up for a grammy or whatever it was... with Blood In My Eyes. I think that shows that they're still somewhat in the public eye, even if they are kind of an afterthought at this point. I don't think you'd be seeing bands like Simple Plan or Good Charlotte reaching that popularity currently.